New AP Poll

[Jennifer]

1 Uconn
2 Stanford
3 Tennessee
4 Duke
5 Oklahoma

8 Baylor
10 ISU
11 Colorado
13 Texas
14 Kansas State
15 Texas Tech

[Bball Girl]

Mississippi State did Tech a favor beating #15 Florida 83-63.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/wbasketball/recap?gameId=220550443

[swok34]

there joking right......??? I thought OU and Tennessee would swap places, but Duke.....I do think the Big XII as a whole as moved up, pretty cool to have practically 50% of the top 15...

Current RPI & SOS:

3) OU 6
8) Texas 3
10)KSU 18
11)TTU 2
12)BU 49
13)ISU 27
16)CU 15
64)OSU 21
73)MU 43
86)NU 42
116) TAMU 72
198) KU 22

During the OU/MU game, the announcers said the Big XII's RPI was #1........here's where:
http://www.wbca.org/upload/rpi022002.pdf

and this is what you call gory details, doesn't the committee use an RPI scale closer to the WBCA's? I don't know what the difference is that they come up with different values.

[This message has been edited by swok34 (edited 02-25-2002).]

[Jennifer]

Originally posted by swok34:
there joking right......??? I thought OU and Tennessee would swap places, but Duke.....I do think the Big XII as a whole as moved up, pretty cool to have practically 50% of the top 15...


Yeah, that's what i thought to. But ya know, Duke did go 16-0 in that awesome ACC conference. Lots of tough teams and great talent. Wait, that's the men's side. Well...repuation is everything I suppose.
Just like the Uconn game--TN loses at home and it doesn't really hurt them much. OU loses on the road (in OT no less) and all of a sudden they are a bubble contender for a #1 seed. So Duke will cake-walk throught the ACC tourney. OU will have a tough road all the way, and if they lose in the champ. game, will they drop even more?

[CyRox98]

I don't see how the committee can keep OU from being a #1 seed. Even if they should falter in the Big 12 tourney (which is unlikely), they deserve a #1. Remember in the men's tourney last year how Iowa State lost in the Big 12 quarterfinals and still got a #2 seed (which was the highest they were going to be anyway)? I think in the case of a team that has put together a great regular season, they will allow for one slip in the post season. After all, if they blow their second chance, there won't be anything left to worry about. I think if anyone is in trouble of not getting a 1, it would be Stanford and their strength of schedule that holds them down. If the Pac 10 weren't so bad this year, they'd be a lock. But I believe OU has earned their 1 seed this year.

[schooner2]

Yes, the committee has always been good about rewarding teams that play a very tough schedule and comparing OU and Duke, it's no contest. I would only be slightly worried if OU lost in the semifinals of the Big 12 Tourney. And I wouldn't worry at all if OU lost in the Big 12 championship game.

Again, though, even if OU slipped to a #2 seed - I don't think I really care. Again, what is most important is what bracket they end up in. If they put OU in the midwest, I'd be very upset. I think the committee surely would understand the potential of a Sweet 16 matchup with Iowa State in Ames.

[swok34]

I think the weakest #1 gets the strongest #2....and wouldn't you think they would consider Stanford the weakest #1 ????
Duke beat out OU last year for that #1 seed.....and neither of us did a thing with it.....

[schooner2]

Noting some of the talk on the wbball email list - it appears they don't always set it up so that the weakest #1 gets the strongest #2. At least, you can't always adhere to such a rule if other considerations have to be made. For example, maybe the committee (I sure hope) will make a point of not putting OU in the Midwest cuz of Iowa State. Maybe trying to adhere to that - it throws off trying to put the strongest 2 with the weakest 1.

But really, who knows....

[Jennifer]

And if they did follow that philosophy (weakest 1 w/ strongest 2) that could mean shipping OU out West if they dropped to a 2.
If ISU were to drop below a host seed, I think they would be more likely to put OU in the Midwest, but surely not if ISU is a 2-4 seed.
Uconn will be #1 in the East--definitely do not want to go there!
Tennessee #1 in the Mideast? Not if they lose, which is highly probable. This is all to tough to figure out.
I really don't envy anyone on the selection committee's job, that's for sure. http://hoopscoop.net/ubb/smile.gif

[Big12Bear]

OU fans: the updated mythical NCAA brackets are up and they still have OU as a 1 seed! http://hoopscoop.net/ubb/smile.gif RPI is still in the top 4, so I like your chances, provided you keep winning.

[swok34]

thanks, Big 12.......kinda looks like last weeks. They have 6 Big XII teams hosting 1st and 2nd rounds and Texas Tech in at a 5 seed.
Though can Kansas State be justified at the 4 seed with Iowa State being a 3 seed?....actually his seedings for the Big XII are mystifying in relation to how the conference race has turned out.....

#1 seed: OU
#3 seeds: BU, ISU, UT
#4 seeds: KSU, CU
#5 seeds: TTU

[YCN]

Actually, Jennifer, I hope that if OU doesn't get a top seed - which would be ridiculous in my opinion, by the way - then I hope they ARE in UConn's regional.

If I didn't think OU could beat Geno's squad, then what is the point in thinking they can win the NCAA's?

[Jennifer]

I would rather them not meet UConn until the Finals. Knock everyone else off on the way there, and then take care of business. http://hoopscoop.net/ubb/smile.gif

[YCN]

I have to actually laugh,

Duke ranked ahead of OU? Surely you jest!

And Stanford?

Let's take this scenario, OU is in the Big East, but there isn't any UConn there. How may games does OU lose?

Answer: None.

Now let's take a conference that is far inferior to the pathetic Big East, the Pac 10.

Stanford has a couple of impressive wins, but loses at home to Tennessee, yes the same UT that lost at home to Texas...

So the Cardinal deserve to be ranked above OU. Heck, let's not stop there, make them ranked higher than Duke, which frankly...

They deserve.

If OU isn't a #1 seed, it will be one of the worst injustices in the history of women's basketball.

[mc6821]

I think the point would be to play UConn at a neutral site, NOT in Storrs....

[YCN]

Jennifer, I don't care who OU plays.

If you believe, then your opponents only justify your belief. I'll take UConn, Duke, Stanford, Tennessee, or any other team.

Any where, any time.

If we don't win, I'll deal with it.

[mc6821]

Oops, east regional is in NC, my bad. However, NC is still much closer to Connecticut than to Oklahoma, so I would guess that Husky fans would outnumber Sooner fans at any potential east matchup.

[YCN]

Who's your team, mc6821?

Or don't you want to out your preferences on a decidedly pro-Big 12 forum?

What's your answer?

[mc6821]

Refer to the "spreadsheet updated" thread...

[swok34]

However, NC is still much closer to Connecticut than to Oklahoma, so I would guess that Husky fans would outnumber Sooner fans at any potential east matchup

And, thinking of bracketing.......Connecticut is going to be place opposite Tennessee and I'll even toss OU in that statement.
Connecticut is always placed opposite Tennessee.....so I think collegerpi has the #1 seeds in the proper region.

Has Connecticut had to go west in the last 4 years? Of course, it would make no sense to send Connecticut west and Stanford east.....and if all plays out, they will be seeded in those regions. Some believe a #1 seed could go west and it would kick Stanford to the #2 seed in the west.

[Jennifer]

Could you imagine the Stanford uproar if they don't get a #1 (provided they win their tourney).

[two cents]

Originally posted by swok34:
During the OU/MU game, the announcers said the Big XII's RPI was #1........here's where:
http://www.wbca.org/upload/rpi022002.pdf

and this is what you call gory details, doesn't the committee use an RPI scale closer to the WBCA's? I don't know what the difference is that they come up with different values.

[This message has been edited by swok34 (edited 02-25-2002).]

There is just a small but meaningful difference between the WBCA and collegerpi versions of conference RPI. Palm's collegerpi version simply averages the RPI's of all the teams in a particular conference to derive the conference RPI. Unfortunately, because of tournaments and other exemptions (also non-D1 games), not all teams in a conference necessarily play the same number of counted games. Failing to weight the team RPI's by number of games results in a fundamental and obvious (to statisticians) miscalculation of the conference RPI average. As tremendous as the site is overall (a real treasure trove), I'm surprised he has never made this basic correction.

The WBCA does it correctly. They treat each conference as a unit, as if it was a single team. The calculation is based on the collective winning percentage of all teams in a conference, collective winning percentage of all opponents of any team in the conference, etc. This is the way it will be done for the committee, because this is the statistically correct version. However, the effect on the actual calculated number is almost trivial. Sometimes, the conferences are so close in overall RPI, that even a slight difference in calculation will result in a change in the ordinal ranking of the conferences. Thus, the discrepancy in rankings.

More significant to the committee in their own ranking of conferences are the head to head records between conferences of teams in the top 50 RPI. This includes all teams definitely in the tournament plus bubble teams. On this criterion, the Big12 is in extremely good shape vis-a-vis the SEC and Big10, the other two contending conferences.

Big 12 vs. SEC
Colorado(16).......W-LSU(30).......L-Van(6), Fla(20)
Texas(9).......W-Tenn(1), LSU(30)
Iowa State(13).......W-Miss St(48)
Texas Tech(11).......W-Van(6)

Big 12 Top 50 vs. SEC Top 50: 5-2
Big 12 Top 50 vs. SEC Top 25: 2-2
Big 12 Top 50 vs. SEC Top10: 2-1

Big 12 vs. Big 10
Oklahoma(3).......W-Pur(5)
Colorado(16).......W-Iowa(32)
Texas(9).......W-Wisc(26).......L-Penn St(25)
Iowa State(13).......W-Iowa(32)
Texas Tech(11).......W-Wisc(26)

Big 12 Top 50 vs. B10 Top 50: 5-1
Big 12 Top 50 vs. B10 Top 25: 1-1
Big 12 Top 50 vs. B10 Top 10: 1-0

In principle, no tournament selection decisions are to be based directly on the conference strengths themselves. Its effect is intended to be indirect as another tool to evaluate individual teams and the toughness of their schedules with respect to factors like road record, last 10 games, the challenge of winning a conference championship, etc.